Algae Problem Part 2- Water Test + History

[Pinkfish]

Hi all,
You all wanted to know what my water Parameters were so here they are:
SG- 1.024
Phosphat - 0.5mg
Nitrit - 0.1mg
Nitrate - 5mg
PH - 8.3
Genral Hardness as Calcium Carbonate - 110mg
Ammonia - 0mg
Free Iron (Non Chelated) - 0mg
Chelated Iron - 0mg
Calcium - 380mg

Used a Nutrafin Test Kit - Samples taken today at 1500 on 13/10/06

Tank Size 60inch Long, 18 inch Wide, 24 inch high + Sump 40 inch Long, 14inch wide x 18 inch high.

History of Tank - Tank set up on - 12 Sept 2006 With Live Rock, Live Sand and Crushed Coral sand. Added some Calaurpa into Sump. Went on Holiday for 2 weeks and tanks were allowed to cycle.

Came back on the 27th Sept and water had almost completely evaporated from Sump all the Calaupra had died.

Refiled System with RO water.

Did a water test and all levels were normal.
Sat 30th Sept bought my first fishes.

Water Flow - 2 x 4400lph powerheads + 2400lph return pump from sump

Total stock is -
1 Salfin Tang, 1 Yellow Tang, 1 Regal Tang, 1 Clown Fish (1 died the other day), 1 firefish (1 found one dead today), 1 Strawberry Gramma, 1 FiaryWrasse, 2 Yellowhead Jawfish, 4 Chromis, 2 mated Pyjama Cardinals
1 Mythrax Crab (Over 1inch) 1 Short spine Urchin, 1 Scooter Blenny

1 Bubble Tip anenome,
1 Pusling Xenia
1 Candy Cane
1 Hammerhead Coral
1 Carnation Coral
1 Large Toadstall Coral
1 Large Finger Coral
1 Brain Coarl
1 small rock with various Zoos
8 Hairy mushrooms

I have added a pic of my full tank and off the problem algae, any advice guys
many thanks
Mike

[Tetley]

Hi all,
You all wanted to know what my water Parameters were so here they are:
SG- 1.024
Phosphat - 0.5mg
Nitrit - 0.1mg
Nitrate - 5mg
PH - 8.3
Genral Hardness as Calcium Carbonate - 110mg
Ammonia - 0mg
Free Iron (Non Chelated) - 0mg
Chelated Iron - 0mg
Calcium - 380mg

Used a Nutrafin Test Kit - Samples taken today at 1500 on 13/10/06

Tank Size 60inch Long, 18 inch Wide, 24 inch high + Sump 40 inch Long, 14inch wide x 18 inch high.

History of Tank - Tank set up on - 12 Sept 2006 With Live Rock, Live Sand and Crushed Coral sand. Added some Calaurpa into Sump. Went on Holiday for 2 weeks and tanks were allowed to cycle.

Came back on the 27th Sept and water had almost completely evaporated from Sump all the Calaupra had died.

Refiled System with RO water.

Did a water test and all levels were normal.
Sat 30th Sept bought my first fishes.

Water Flow - 2 x 4400lph powerheads + 2400lph return pump from sump

Total stock is -
1 Salfin Tang, 1 Yellow Tang, 1 Regal Tang, 1 Clown Fish (1 died the other day), 1 firefish (1 found one dead today), 1 Strawberry Gramma, 1 FiaryWrasse, 2 Yellowhead Jawfish, 4 Chromis, 2 mated Pyjama Cardinals
1 Mythrax Crab (Over 1inch) 1 Short spine Urchin, 1 Scooter Blenny

1 Bubble Tip anenome,
1 Pusling Xenia
1 Candy Cane
1 Hammerhead Coral
1 Carnation Coral
1 Large Toadstall Coral
1 Large Finger Coral
1 Brain Coarl
1 small rock with various Zoos
8 Hairy mushrooms

I have added a pic of my full tank and off the problem algae, any advice guys
many thanks
Mike


Hi Mike,

These readings will help.

I have only limited experience, but I must admit, there is nothing which jumps out to me as a problem.

Phosphat is showing a reading, but not excessive IMO.

Number of fish will not help (sorry to say) , can you find a alternative home for some of them, at least this will give your tank time to mature.

I am sure one of our more experienced reefers will input knowledge & give you a few pointers.

Chin up

ATB

Ian

[Macca]

SG- 1.024
Phosphat - 0.5mg
Nitrit - 0.1mg
Nitrate - 5mg
PH - 8.3
Genral Hardness as Calcium Carbonate - 110mg
Ammonia - 0mg
Free Iron (Non Chelated) - 0mg
Chelated Iron - 0mg
Calcium - 380mg


What stands out at me is a showing of Nitrite, No matter how low you think this is (Which to be honest it still far far to high), There is a sign that nitrite is present and detectable. Try measuring this after feeding etc. How well is your protein skimmer working? You have a huge bio load for a new system and you can be having spikes in your Ammonia / Nitrite which is stressing and possibly killing your fish. When your fish are stressed then this can lead to diseases. I honestly think that starting your sytem with so much livestock will cause even more problems as time goes on. Have to agree with above and maybe best temporally give your livestock a new home until Nitrite is undetectable, then slowly add your livestock back in

James

[Kev]

Mike

Sorry about the loss of your clown fish by the way.

I would agree with James. I think you need to be targeting not a trace of nitrite showing on your tests.

I think the choice is yours, but I would be looking to rehouse, some, if not all of your fish stock to dramatically reduce the bioload in your system. In my mind the absolute golden rule in a new system is stock slowly. I am also thinking that you have some pretty sensitive inverts in there, the bubble tip for instance, which would be really suited to a tank that has had time to mature.

The algae I would argue is definitely not uncommon in a new tank, but in time, with care and attention, will disappear. However, with the huge bioload that you have in such a young system, additional nutrients are going into the tank feeding the algae.

I remember one of the things I struggled with many years ago, was the amount of time it takes to develop the stability in conditions / parameters we strive to achieve.

As I said, I think it is down to individual choice, but I would look to remove some stock on a temporary basis, despite how hard this is.

Kev

[Tangman]

Hi Mike I think your only option is strip the tank and catch all the fish and along with all your corals and invertebrates and return them to your LFS. If this task is daunting you see if your LFS owner or a fishy friend will give you a helping hand. By doing this your tank is going to have time to settle and mature, you want to keep all our water and virtually start again but slower. Have you got an auto top up system on your tank so that your evaporation is getting topped up with fresh water, if not get one. When your parameters are ok start adding clean up crew, then wait for a few weeks and if your parameters are still ok start and add 1 fish then wait for 4 weeks and add 1 more fish and so on until your up to your stocking level. If you need any advice any time dont be frightened to ask on here and we all will help you through it. HTH. Eric

[SteveS]

hi mike, thanks for taking the time to reply in such detail. this is just my opinion of what i would do and the more people who post the better.

you probably dont want to do this, but i would take your corals back to your lfs and either get a credit note or store them there. especially your bubble tip nem, whats your lighting btw?

the urchin needs to go back m8, as these are sensative to water quality.

ask your lfs if they have a fish/pest trap you could borrow and catch as many fish as possible, do the same as the corals. even if you cant get all the fish out at least you have decreased the load. even if a credit note is half what you paid at least youve got something m8.

ok whats next...imo a large water change 20% maybe, then 10% every 5/6 days keep monitoring your water and any remaining live stock.

add some rowaphos or kent phosphate sponge to control po4, this is difficult to test when algaes present (another story)

looking at your pics, it looks like you need more flow in too, your p/heads should be facing the centre of the front glass so the flow hits in the middle. with additional powerheads in you can place these anywhere.

some drastic action now mike will save you alot of time,money and heartache in my opinion and maybe even save you throwing the towel in.

keep posting mate, thats why were here, weve all being there and were all hobbyist, none of us are selling anything.

which brings me to, surely some of the blame for this must lie with mikes lfs...when a new face starts buying bubble tip nems, hard to keep corals and several fish in a short space of time, shouldnt they be asking questions?

regards
steve

[mrc]

Not being critidal mate cos i made a similar mistake but did your lfs not advise you against such heavy stocking to start with mine didt any how touch wood im going slowly now and reading all this type of site to pick the brains of the experts good luck

[thereefshop]

If i was you i would have to question your lfs for selling you all that live stock in a short space of time !!!!:mad: i would say you are feeding your fish to much which is in turn feeding your algae. i would agree with what james and the others are saying house the live stock if you can and add it slowly when things are looking better.

How much live rock do you have in tank??? and what skimmer do you have ???
and your water movement may need to be greater.

the only way algae can grow is if you are feeding it something if you have next to nothing phosphates you must be feeding it something i.e. frozen foods
to many additives(phyto from a bottle) etc i would do lots of waterchanges
get carbon running and a good phosphate remover.

No2:confused: :confused: are you cleaning the filter system?
if the tank has cycled the only way you will get no2 is if your filter system bacteria has been killed off:confused: i would look into this more!!

[Pinkfish]

Thanks for the advice guys,

I will try and take some of the stock back to my lfs.

If I am unable to do so what else can I do?

Im running a DSB sump with a V2 1200 TMC Skimmer

Lighting is done by 4 T5's 2x 14000k Whites and 2x Blues

Live rock - I have circa 50 Kilos of it in the tank.

I probably am overfeeding my stock, I will reduce the amount I feed them which is currently 3x a day- 1 frozen block of food and about a 2 pence piece of nori (Seaweed). I Alternate what frozen food that I give them.

Whats the easiest way to romove Nirite ?

Many thanks
Mike

[Kev]

Hi Mike

One sure way of doing it in this instance is to reduce the bioload, and give the nitrifying bacteria chance to develop, prior to slowly increasing bioload. As said earlier, some hefty water changes could help, but without the development of nitrifying bacteria, the problem will keep recurring in my opinion?

There may be some products out there that others can advise you on, but my preference is for the more traditional way, not forcing things.

Kev

[finlee]

As I was a total novice to the world of marine fish keeping the lfs where I bought my tank would not let me buy any fish until the tank had been set up with live rock and sand for 3-4 weeks. They then did a water test for me to check it then they sold me one fish and one coral and told me to wait for 2 weeks before adding the same again (or 2 fish) to give the tank chance to cycle with the new additions. To me this was sound advice and a year on I've not had any problems and all my water paramaters have always been good.

[Kev]

Finlee, sounds like an lfs that you can put your trust in there.

Kev

[Gillybaby]

Hi Mike

I can only agree with everything that has been said already really. You are basically experience what is known as "new tank syndrome". We've all been through it to varying degrees and it can take months or even a year to stablise. Your experience is merely being exaggerated by the quick over stocking. Bear in mind that even if you dramatically reduce your stock (which I also would recommend) you are still going to experience the various algae stages and fluctuations in parameters, they won't just go away overnight. Its just that with a slow stocking regime it is much easier to combat each stage as and when it happens.

Please don't feel disheartened by this, we've all gone through it at some point. Stick with it, take the advice given here and fingers crossed in 6 months to a year you will have a system anyone would be proud to call their own ;)

Keep us posted :D

[SteveS]

any updates mike?

did your lfs take any live stock back off you?

steve