Salt Mixes / Survey

[Macca]

<strong>Reef Corals Salt Mix Survey - Average Values</strong></br>
<table width="80%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="2"><tr><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><img src="images/spacer.gif" width="100" height="1" /></td><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><img src="images/spacer.gif" width="100" height="1" /></td><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><img src="images/spacer.gif" width="50" height="1" /></td><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><img src="images/spacer.gif" width="50" height="1" /></td><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><img src="images/spacer.gif" width="50" height="1" /></td><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><img src="images/spacer.gif" width="50" height="1" /></td><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><img src="images/spacer.gif" width="50" height="1" /></td><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><img src="images/spacer.gif" width="50" height="1" /></td><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><img src="images/spacer.gif" width="50" height="1" /></td></tr>
<tr><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><strong>Brand</strong></td><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><div align="center"><strong>Tests Compiled</strong></div></td><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><div align="center"><strong>SG</strong></div></td><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><div align="center"><strong>PH</strong></div></td><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><div align="center"><strong>KH</strong></div></td><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><div align="center"><strong>PO4</strong></div></td><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><div align="center"><strong>CA</strong></div></td><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><div align="center"><strong>MG</strong></div></td><td bgcolor="#CCCCCC"><div align="center"><strong>NO3</strong></div></td></tr><tr><td><strong>Seachem</strong></td><td><div align="center"><strong>1</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>1.024</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>-</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>9</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>0</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>440</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>1320</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>0</strong></div></td></tr><tr> <td><strong>Instant Ocean</strong></td>
<td><div align="center"><strong>1</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>1.026</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>-</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>11.2</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>-</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong><font color="#FF0000">360</font></strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>1410</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>-</strong></div></td></tr><tr> <td><div align="left"><strong>AM Reef Salt</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>1</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>1.023</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>-</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>9</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>-</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>440</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong><font color="#FF0000">930</font></strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>-</strong></div></td></tr><tr><td><strong>Reef Crystals</strong></td><td><div align="center"><strong>2</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>1.026</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>-</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>10.65</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>0</strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong><font color="#FF0000">380</font></strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong><font color="#FF0000">1100</font></strong></div></td><td><div align="center"><strong>0</strong></div></td></tr></table>
<p><strong>Contributors: Gary Smith, Gillybaby</strong></p>

I am totally fed up with well known salt manufacturers short changing us reefers with diluted mixes that cost a fortune. :mad: You may remember I mentioned how I was going to buy the cheapest salt and add additives myself to get the salt to natural sea water (NSW). :p I then became wary of trace elements etc. For the sake of everyone in the forum can other reefers please add to this thread the value of their salt mixes they are using with brand of salt? I am doing a fresh mix later and will post results tomorrow. I am fed up with phosphate readings etc in Salt Mixes???

Please remember to make this as accurate as possible; I will then devise a calculation that brings up average values of parameters. We will keep this thread going so we can determine which salt to buy and which salt to leave on your LFS shelf for the sake of many.

I know Calfo and Fenner have voiced their opinion on which salt to buy but I would take this information very very lightly. Sponsorship??? I am wary on S Hauter tables of Salt mixes also; Lets try this ourselves!

1. Make sure and use RO water and test and note parameters.
2. Raise temp of water to 25 degrees.
3. Add salt slowly and raise salinity to 1.024
4. Aerated salt mix for 12-24 hours.

Test for

1. Alk
2. Calcium
3. PH
4. Magnesium
5. Nitrate
6. Phosphates

Please PM me your results. If you cannot test for one or more values then just leave blank.

All feedback / suggestions welcome.

James

PS The results will only show which salt is closest to NSW in terms of elements and compounds tested only. There are many trace elements not tested that certain brands may have diluted also. My means of thinking is if they cannot get the so called major elements right then there is no point in buying due to the fact they assure they have added all NSW trace elements.

[Gillybaby]

Great idea James. We've been struggling to find a good salt since we started keeping marines more than 2 years ago. Have a barrel of the new Seachem salt brewing at the moment. Will pm the results to you later.

[Macca]

Gilly to be honest I have been disappointed with seachem, used 6 25kg tubs in the last 2 months and 5 have been ok and 1 was terrible with phosphates etc. I know you can get a bad batch but surely this should be picked up at QC. I have Red Sea Coral pro on the go and will update results shortly. Good luck with your batch as most retailers think its great. Nothing agaist retailers but some info we get is due to mark up. :( None of our sponsors obviously. :p

James

[Gillybaby]

Know what you mean. The first salt we used was Aquamedic which I know loads of people rave about. However, it was low in nearly everything. Our first tank was in a really bad way at the start and our lfs and folk on forums just kept saying do regular 10-20% water changes. But things were getting worse. When we discovered it was the salt you can just imagine our reaction ;) The minute we changed the tank improved 100%.

Looking forward to seeing all the results.

[reefbloke]

Im getting the right hump too at the mo.I love Reef Crystals but dont love the low Magnesium! Last month i did a very large water change of 160 gal over the period of a week.I now find myself looking to purchase 35 quids worth of Mag Chloride and sulphate to sort out a Mag level of 1000 in my tank.Piggin salt GGGRRRRRRRR!
Anyone know a good un high in Mag,dont mind sorting out Cal/Alk but Mag is too expensive to sort out in my opinion.

[Tetley]

Im getting the right hump too at the mo.I love Reef Crystals but dont love the low Magnesium! Last month i did a very large water change of 160 gal over the period of a week.I now find myself looking to purchase 35 quids worth of Mag Chloride and sulphate to sort out a Mag level of 1000 in my tank.Piggin salt GGGRRRRRRRR!
Anyone know a good un high in Mag,dont mind sorting out Cal/Alk but Mag is too expensive to sort out in my opinion.

I am aslo using "Reef Crystals" my tank MG is reading 1020, and like you fed up :mad: with it.

Maybe time to change brands?

ATB

[MR Teee]

Started off with Seachem reef salt. No problems with it except the price.

Moved to red sea pro (still not cured the price issue) But gives consistently better results. I will post them up when I mix a new batch up.

[Blue]

Great idea, can't wait to see the results:)

[Macca]

I believe Gilly will be adding some results, my mix is 24 hour behind schedule. If any others are doing a fresh mix please log details and PM them to me.

James

[Gillybaby]

Sorry about that James, will post results once I've tidied the house. The nano took longer to sort than expected on Wednesday and I've got a cold and couldn't be bothered to do anything but go straight to bed yesterday after work.

I've also got some old results from previous buckets lying around somewhere as well, I'll look them out too.

[Zeus]

Hi all,

Just a thought, rather than buying 25kg drums pehaps buying smaller quantities of different salts would be a solution. No pun intended there folks. :)

Say for instance 6 x 4kg packet/boxes, a box each of Aqua Medic, Instant Ocean/Reef Crystals, Kent, Rea Sea, Tropic Marin and mixing them in equal parts to achieve your 35ppt/1.026SG.

Edit: Just for clarity, to mix 50 litres RO to 35ppt you'd need 1750grams of salt mix, so with the above 6 salts you'd need approx 292grams of each.

Maybe a wee bit more expensive but if the result are closer to NSW and more importantly consistantly within a small percentage difference, would it not be worth it?

Again just a thought.
Campbell

[mad pierre]

Hi James,

I seem to be the only one using Tropic Marin on here...Is there something I should know about?
Unfortunatly I dont have most of the test kits you are looking for so wont be able to help out with the survey just yet (unless someone close to me wants to check my next batch?)

If I think on I will bring a sample down with me next time im at the shop unless you have some Tropic results already by then.

Peter

[lr85ninety]

im using reef crystals its the only salt iv used and i was beginning to wonder why my mag was low so thanks for this thread saved me some head scratching!

[sinaarrgghh]

lr85ninety - Same here though I tested mine about a month ago and found out.

mad pierre - I'm only in thornaby and have the kits. I guess I could lend them to you or whatever if you need.

Tetley - Yes I think I will pick a different brand next time!

Macca - Great idea! Thanks :)

[mad pierre]

mad pierre - I'm only in thornaby and have the kits. I guess I could lend them to you or whatever if you need.


Thanks. Might be best if someone who had used them before did the test for the purposes of the survey. Wouldnt want to sway the result with inexperience.
You'd be welcome to come over and see my setup if you like? Could pick you up at the time if it would help.

Cheers,
Peter

[dollydip]

peter im in redcar if you want it testing you can pm me mate if you need it :D:D

[dollydip]

right james just tested my bucket of salt i got from you the other day so here are your results

instant ocean
ca 410
mg 1350
kh 15.4

HTH your survey james :D:D

[mfcfan]

what salt you using andy?

steve :)

[dollydip]

post edited:o

[Shultz]

I use KZ Reefers Best, doing a water change sunday so if I remember I'll test it before using ( I know roughly, but in fairness test a fresh batch)....

This salt is designed to be used within a couple of hours of mixing (ready after just an hour!) so can't leave it overnight although this shouldn't effect the results I get?

Cheers, Shelton.

[shimmyuk]

Peter, I too use Tropic Marin (Pro Reef) so your not alone...lol

I will be mixing a batch up in the next day or two, so will do the tests on it. (Don't have a Mag test though so that one will be omited).


Tony

[gary smith]

i am trying tropic marin standard at the moment the results are

alk 11.2

mag 1050 :mad:

cal 350 :mad:

i need 121 grams of mag chloride and 16 grams of mag sulphate not to mention 13.5 grams of cal chloride to balance a 12 gall water change:eek:

Andy you are a lucky ****** :rolleyes: i have been looking for that bucket of salt for 3 years :pcheers Gary

[dollydip]

sorry gary but im willing to share mate :D:D

[elliee]

hi everyone a very intresting survey for us all ,ive got 3 x 10 gallon drums on the go for a water change tomorrow, i always test my salt from start to finish and they seem to vary from batch to batch ,i know they should'nt but they do ,so test results as follows
instant ocean sg 1026
nitrate 0-2 salifert
calcium 350 salifert
magnesium 1170 salifert
dkh 12.5 salifert
phosphate 0 deltec
so i will adjust magnesium to 1350 and then calcium to around 420 before i add it to my tank.as said before we are all paying good money for it so they all should get it right all the time
glyn

[mad pierre]

i am trying tropic marin standard at the moment the results are

alk 11.2

mag 1050 :mad:

cal 350 :mad:

i need 121 grams of mag chloride and 16 grams of mag sulphate not to mention 13.5 grams of cal chloride to balance a 12 gall water change:eek:

Gary

Thats got me worried as I use the std Tropic Marin as well.
Looks like I will be taking someone up on their offer next time I do a change:eek:

Peter

[ovesk8]

Guys your not alone, i use the standard tropic marin salt and have done since i started with no issues of low mag or ca so im now confused. Ill test a fresh batch tomorrow and let you know my results. My system is currently around the following with no buffing whatsoever!

Nitrate 2-5
Phosphate 0.1
Ca 430
Mg 1350
Dkh 8
ph 8.0
salt 1.025

Strange as the dkh looked high on your results at around 11 but mine is constant even through 10% water changes???

I would recommend tropic marin over others anyday. This is just my experience though;)

[mad pierre]

Guys your not alone, i use the standard tropic marin salt and have done since i started with no issues of low mag or ca so im now confused. Ill test a fresh batch tomorrow and let you know my results. My system is currently around the following with no buffing whatsoever!

Nitrate 2-5
Phosphate 0.1
Ca 430
Mg 1350
Dkh 8
ph 8.0
salt 1.025

Strange as the dkh looked high on your results at around 11 but mine is constant even through 10% water changes???

I would recommend tropic marin over others anyday. This is just my experience though;)

I wonder if differences in preperation method cause dropout of trace elements between different users of the same salt (and even batches)?

Ive noticed that I used to get some hard particles left in the bottom of the drum when I used a sander wood block for airation (of the new mix). Since changing to one of those large blue airstones it doesnt seem to be there?

Peter

[dollydip]

hi everyone a very intresting survey for us all ,ive got 3 x 10 gallon drums on the go for a water change tomorrow, i always test my salt from start to finish and they seem to vary from batch to batch ,i know they should'nt but they do ,so test results as follows
instant ocean sg 1026
nitrate 0-2 salifert
calcium 350 salifert
magnesium 1170 salifert
dkh 12.5 salifert
phosphate 0 deltec
so i will adjust magnesium to 1350 and then calcium to around 420 before i add it to my tank.as said before we are all paying good money for it so they all should get it right all the time
glyn


well there you go glyns tub of instant ocean is way different to mine as was garys with these sresults in mind its easy to see why i had problems with my mg and ca it looks like constant buffering is needed imho:D:D

[ovesk8]

Yes interesting peter as i also use a wood airstone with a pump in a salt bucket for mixing. Didnt get the same sort of salt granules in the bottom like you though? Always done the same and seems to be ok. This has me intrigued now so im going to check a new salt mix over the weekend and see what that comes out like.:)

[shimmyuk]

Ok, just done the tests on my mix of Tropic Marin Pro Reef. Here are the results. Not too sure on the PO4 though, i think i need to get another test kit as this one has gave me a reading of 0.25 on EVERY test i've done with it since having it.:confused: Anyone recommend a good one? Is the Salfert one good?

SG - 1.025 (refractometer)
PH - 8.1 (PH meter)
KH - 9.3 (Salfert)
PO4 - 0.25 (Hagen)
Ca - 400 (Hagen)
NO3 - 0 (Hagen)

Tony

[ovesk8]

My results are in for standard tropic marin. Little gutted on the calcium actually:(

Salt at 1.023
Temp 25

P.h 8.1/2
Dkh 10
Magnesium 1350
Calcium 350

Salt tested was bit lower than i run in the tank (1.026) So results may be very slightly higher if tested at 1.025 like others.

[VP Clown]

Red Sea Coral Pro

RO water from LFS
SG 1.024 - Refractometer
Calcium 480 - Salifert
Magnesium 1350 - Salifert
pH 8.3 - pinpoint meter
Nitrate 0 - Salifert

Andy,

[dollydip]

thats another good salt batch andy seems to a few about lately:D:D are the makers of the salts taking more care?????