Raising PH without using kalk??

[gregh]

In my fight against dinoflagelletes I'm aiming to raise my PH, as per this article:

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-11/rhf/index.php

However I really don't want to add a kalk stirrer, so are there any other methods to keep PH higher at night?

I need to keep it around 8.4 overnight.

I have a Tunze auto top up, and run a calc reactor to keep my alk and calcium levels up.

Cheers,

Greg

[keith]

Your Calcium reactor will put downward pressure on your PH. Have you thought about switching it off at night.

Keith

[gregh]

I have a PH computer which switches the Co2 off as PH hits 8.0, so there is no Co2 at night really.

I could maybe switch it off earlier, and keep a close eye on my alk and calc...

[MR Teee]

You dont need a kalk stirrer to add kalk.
Why not make a 2 liter pop bottle dripper and add that to that tank at night.

I'm really not sure that there is any other ways to raise the PH.

[gregh]

cheers for that idea, but I thought you needed to keep stirring kalk to stop it settling at the bottom?

If not the pop bottle should work a treat!

Regards,

Greg

[MR Teee]

Nope, Infact you need it to settle before you can dose it.
Here is the procedure.

1. Fill the pop bottle with 2 litres of RO.
2. Add 2 teaspoons of kalk.
3. Put lid on and shake for a minute.
4. Let it settle until you have a nearly clear liquid sat on top of the kalk. (mine has never gone totally clear)
5. Drill 2 holes in the lid.
6. Screw lid on.
7. Insert a short bit of airline into the bottle.
8. Make the other airline a dripper by tieing a knot in it.
9. Insert this in the other hole.
10. BLOW into the short airline to start the syphon.
11. Adjust the tightness of the knot to get about 1 drip per 1-2 seconds.
12. Monitor PH and adjust drip rate accordingly.

If you have any Q's fire away Greg.

HTH

[gregh]

sounds pretty easy, will give it a try :)

I take it you use this method, do you drip 24x7?

How often does the bottle need topping up? I'm away on business for the next 2 weeks, so would like to make it easy for my missus to do!

regards,

greg

[MR Teee]

I do use it but with a 5 gallon water machine container.

I dont drip 24/7 either, as my calcium and alk useage is not that tremendus at the moment.

I would suggest that you only drip the kalk at night to maintain the Ph when it is more inclined to drop.

If you do this its simply a case of before you go away, add maybe 5 teaspoons of kalk, then all the missus has to do is fill it up with RO (at whatever frequency you are dosing) e.g every night , shake and let it settle, and start the drips by blowing down the second tube.


As this is a balanced way of adding calcium and Alk, you should make sure they are actually in balance before you start.
And the only thing to watch out for is the dripper line getting blocked, this is easily fixed by a dunk in hot water for 5 mins.

[gregh]

thanks.I need to seal the pipes into the lid??

[MR Teee]

Nope, just size the holes to get a nice tight fit.

ooooeerrrrrr!

[gregh]

ok cheers, off to try it, lights just gone out.

Kalk bought, pop bottle bought and emptied/cleaned :)

Last question, I assume I have the "exit" pipe sitting just above the settled kalk so that it doesn't suck the kalk out??

regards,

Greg

[Macca]

YEP and also watch out for the surface skim in the bottle. If you had another bottle you could have syphoned off the clear water inbetween the surface and the sediment then dosed without worrying about either,

James

[gregh]

ok cheers, it ran all night, but ph still dropped to 8.04 (which is an improvement) but ideally I'd like it as high as 8.3 overnight.

So should I put > 2 teaspoons into the 2 litres of RO water, or drip faster?

Lastly should I throw away the remaining mixture and mix a fresh batch every day/when it get's low?

regards,

Greg

[MR Teee]

If there is still some sediment in the mixture then adding more than 2 teaspoons will have no effect, as its already reached its saturation capacity.

Dripping faster will probably help maybe go for 2 drips per second and see whats happening.

I personally would keep reusing the slurry in the bottom of the bottle until it is exhausted, but others have different feelings.


Another thing that could be causing the PH swing is CO2 accumulation in the tank room. Is there a good supply of fresh air in the room. If not it might be worth running your skimmer air intake so that it can draw air from the outside. Also does your tank have good surface agitation to help the gas exchange?

[gregh]

the skimmer air intake is inside the sump area under the tank, so I reckon running an airline from outside to that would help lots....

regards,

Greg

[Harrison]

Hi Greg,

How much fresh water do you need to add on daily basis to replace that lost to evaporation? If it’s more than 2 litres simply use a larger bottle and increase the kalk accordingly.

I don’t think you’ll gain anything from dripping kalk faster as your still adding 2 litres over night. Dosing quickly may lead to precipitation or rapidly fluctuating ph levels. I was told the max rate of dosing Kalk is 16ml per minute although I can’t see that being gospel as it would have very different effects on different sized tanks.

You may also want to consider turning off your Calcium Reactor for a few hours during night (only turn the CO2 supply off), the addition of Kalk will be helping to maintain Ca & Alk. This should also help maintaining a higher ph.

Cheers

Matthew

[Zeus]

Another thing that could be causing the PH swing is CO2 accumulation in the tank room. Is there a good supply of fresh air in the room. If not it might be worth running your skimmer air intake so that it can draw air from the outside. Also does your tank have good surface agitation to help the gas exchange?

Hi, I agree with Mr Teee, increasing surface agitation and aeration should help. I am not sure about using additional airpumps and airstones, I wouldn't but I know some folks that do.

Campbell

[Chris, Reef Ranch]

Hi Greg,

Are you raising the pH to try and crash it out? What you are doing there is messing with the water chemistry! Messing about with water chemistry after a problem with possibly sulphide from you top up water is not the thing to do. Only slow protracted changes. Sulphide is probably responsible for dropping the pH in the first place.

Follow my advice at the store to the letter and it will go. Sorry to be so forthright but the problem you have is phosphate and low Oxidative Redox Potential (ORP). Messing with the ionic balance of the water when you have low ORP is dangerous. If cause a precipitation event you could loose all your stock. I have only your best interest at heart.

Chris

PS I hope this is the right Greg!?

[gregh]

Yup, it's the right Greg,

There was an article by Randy Holmes saying raising PH would cure it, however one week of doing so didn't help at all, it actually got worse!!

How do I increase ORP or indeed find out if it is low to start with???

regards

Greg